New PC Issues, Need Advice.

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Shawn Bybee

PCHF Member
Apr 13, 2018
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I'll give details but incase they are not needed to answer my question I'll do the tl;dr first. I am building new PC (not my first) and had everything ready to flip the power switch on power supply, but when I did various lights flickered and then nothing happened and the power button for PC didn't work. Did various things, kept trying and then I seen a small puff of smoke. Pulled out phone and made 3 videos of me searching for and finding smoke which ended up being 2 chips on the motherboard that had holes on top of them that would poof smoke every time I flipped power switch on power supply.

Is there anything I could have done to cause this, something I should watch out for when my fixed motherboard comes back and I try again?
or
when this occurs, is it obvious that it is a motherboard issue and I shouldn't have issues when it comes back? (there is a reason I'm asking)

Brand New Parts
-i7 - 12700k
-MSI Z790 Gaming Pro Motherboard
-Thermaltake Toughpower 750W 80+ Gold
-Cooler Master Hyper 620s
-G.Skill Trident Z5 (2x16GB) DDR5 7200
-be quiet! Pure Base 500DX

Used Parts
- Kingspec SSD 1TB ( 2 months old. I bought it for the new PC but tested it in my 6 yr old built PC with HDD to feel the difference. I did not format it or anything, when I was ready for new PC I removed from old PC and plugged into new PC. )
- Mouse & Keyboard are wired and over a year old from old PC.

Inside of the PC I had everything plugged into motherboard. Case, lights from case, lights from fans

Items I Had Connected to Motherboard Externally
-Mouse & Keyboard (does them having old USB plugs and the motherboard having all 3.2 USB inputs matter?)
-Ethernet Cable (cat6 - don't know if that matters)
-Old USB Flash Drive with an ISO version of windows
-HDMI cable (not new and possibly over 2-3 years old)

After realizing the 2 chips had holes I unplugged PC and hooked old keyboard & mouse and the SSD back up to my old pc. The mouse does not work at all, the keyboard works but the lights do not and the SSD that I used for 2 months can not even be recognized by the old PC. I do not know if CPU or memory was affected the same way, no way to test. The PSU seems fine and makes the motherboard smoke every time switch is flipped so "I guess" it's working.

1. Is there anything I could have done to cause this?
2. Why does my mouse and SSD not work anymore?
3. If the damage goes farther than mouse and SSD (CPU or memory) am I screwed or is the motherboard maker at fault, kind of thing? I'm already down a mouse, SSD and the RGB lighting from my keyboard.
4. Is it good to have EVERYTHING plugged in on first post or is there a certain/special way to hook things up? From posting PC with only motherboard (if possible) to only plugging certain cables in at certain points? ( I don't know how to ask what I am asking but hopefully you get it ;)

Here are the 3 videos of the motherboard.
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Had to pay $50 to send a brand new board that doesn't work correctly back to be fixed (which I don't understand) so I'm trying to make sure it works this time. I'm going to replace the SSD with an M.2 SSD this time as well. I tried to look up mouse and keyboards with 3.2 USB connectors but that doesn't seem to be a thing when searching so I'm guessing that my old keyboard and mouse were not an issue.

ANY advise is appreciated. Thank You
 
Maybe with the replacement board, set it up out of the case, on a piece of cardboard first.
Just connect the things needed to test the board is OK and you get a signal to the screen.
So, no USB devices, one RAM stick, no GPU if the CPU and mobo support onboard graphics, just the boot drive, that sort of thing, keep it simple at this stage.
 
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xrobwx71 said:
1. If you turn power on to anything, a lamp, a pc, anything and you see smoke. Stop. Take it to a trained technician or RMA the part.
Make sure the standoffs are not touching any of the electrical paths or solder joints.


Page 5 is the info on the standoff positions for your mobo. Also pages 8&9 may help.
Click to expand...
1. I did stop, but the issue is I am a smoker and NEEDED to make sure the smoke I just seen was from the board. I learned a lesson, don't smoke until it post. I put it out when I went to see what was wrong so it was still in the air kind of thing. ( To whom may read this, i'm just being honest, not looking for advise on smoking)

Everything else you mentioned was good.
Bruce said:
Maybe with the replacement board, set it up out of the case, on a piece of cardboard first.
Just connect the things needed to test the board is OK and you get a signal to the screen.
So, no USB devices, one RAM stick, no GPU if the CPU and mobo support onboard graphics, just the boot drive, that sort of thing, keep it simple at this stage.
Click to expand...
I was thinking about not hooking anything extra up to the board that isn't needed to get it to turn on but you took it a step farther, I'll defiantly try this first, ty
 
Bruce said:
@Shawn Bybee - any progress?
Click to expand...
it says it shipped today at 6pm.
They got it on the 18th and on that day it said shipping date 3/25/2024 but the status still said repairing until an hour ago.
Made me wonder if they have a time limit on how long they have to fix before they take different steps, or even if it gets fixed on the 19th, that will be the date it ships.

But no still waiting, I will 100% update the thread when progress has been made.
 
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While I'm waiting on motherboard I have a few questions about the GPU I will be buying. I'm new to talking about this so if something doesn't make sense, it's me. Plz correct me if I'm wrong.

The 4060 seems to be the highest I can go before my gpu is bottleneck by my cpu according to calculators. I'm planning on going with the 4060 ti 16gb or the 4070 12gb.

1. what is better, a cpu bottleneck, a gpu bottleneck or should you always choose no bottleneck? I heard if your gpu is bottlenecked by the cpu, you can use the extra/wasted gpu power to push "ultra" graphic settings at 1080p whereas if there was not bottleneck at cpu meaning there is no extra/wasted gpu power you would only get "high" graphics at 1080p.

1.5. If the cpu is the bottleneck that means the cpu is near or at it's max and from what I have seen from watching gaming youtubers that mostly have 50% cpu bottlenecks (good cpu matched with the best gpu's) they crash a lot making me think that the cpu is being maxed out to the point of allowing the game to crash.



I'm watching a video where he's comparing 4060 ti 8gb vs 4060 ti 16gb and in most demanding games the 8gb maxes out at around 6600-7000 before it starts to borrow from the system memory VS the 16gb will be using 9000-12000 for most of the games that the 8gb maxed out on. If most of the games ran mostly at 10000- 12000 and the 8gb starts to borrow from system at 1000-1300 less than the stated 8gb, that would mean that the 12gb will run at 9000-10000 before it starts to borrow from system memory.?.

Because of that it really makes me want to to go for the 4060 ti 16gb so I never borrow from system memory but it has 4352 cores

Then I see that the 4070 12gb has 5888 cores but the 12gb may cause games to use system memory.

Which makes me want to go with the 4060 ti 16gb

2. Is having more cores better than more vram when you can upgrade your system ram and not worry/care if the gpu borrows system memory meaning the 5888 cores with the 4070 would be better? I have 32gb of 7200 ram, which I understand is most stable around 6200-6600, so I'm thinking the 4070 with the 5888 cores and just allow gpu to borrow system memory.

Thanks for replies.
 
I'll let others talk about bottlenecking - it's not an area I've needed to invest money in as I'm not a gamer.

There will always be a bottleneck somewhere - that's Computing 101.
When I upgraded to a SSD years ago, I was getting rid of the biggest bottleneck on my system, the I/O on the HDD.
But I realised I was just moving the problem upstream to the processor or onboard graphics, depending on my usage.
But for my demands, it was well worth it.

As to which bottleneck is preferred - a CPU one or a GPU one, that's going to be a subjective answer.
GPU would be easier to upgrade, swap out and swap in new card - but costly and chances are you'll be wanting a new PSU eventually.
CPU would be cheaper but you'll hit a limit that then requires a new mobo

You are chasing one of the Holy Grail's and even with a generous budget, there will always be something more shiny that you'll want.
 
Bruce said:
I'll let others talk about bottlenecking - it's not an area I've needed to invest money in as I'm not a gamer.

There will always be a bottleneck somewhere - that's Computing 101.
When I upgraded to a SSD years ago, I was getting rid of the biggest bottleneck on my system, the I/O on the HDD.
But I realised I was just moving the problem upstream to the processor or onboard graphics, depending on my usage.
But for my demands, it was well worth it.

As to which bottleneck is preferred - a CPU one or a GPU one, that's going to be a subjective answer.
GPU would be easier to upgrade, swap out and swap in new card - but costly and chances are you'll be wanting a new PSU eventually.
CPU would be cheaper but you'll hit a limit that then requires a new mobo

You are chasing one of the Holy Grail's and even with a generous budget, there will always be something more shiny that you'll want.
Click to expand...
I understand what your saying.

what would you go with though,
-4070 12gb more cores with less memory
-4060 ti 16 gb less cores with more memory





Ok I got my mb back. I have it on cardboard and want to check before I turn it on because I'm scared :)

-The CPU is in socket with heatsink installed with paste, but the fans are not plugged in.
-1 memory stick installed
-The main 24 pin power connector for mb and both 8 pin connectors for cpu plugged in.
-The wires from the case that control the power button are plugged in

I just want to see the motherboard turn on and stay on before I go further. I dont want to see display or have keyboard and mouse hooked up yet. The motherboard has only ever flickered on and off in a split sec so I just want to see motherboard come on, lights on board light up and stay on then shut off and I will plug in more stuff.

Are the 4 things I have hooked up enough to just turn motherboard on? If the motherboard doesn't detect fans plugged in will it turn on?

Waiting for reply, thank you
 
Well it did not work. I plugged the power supply in and as soon as I flipped the switch on the PSU a light or 2 flickered on and off and it acted the exact same way as it did before. I didn't even hit the button on the case to turn it on, as soon as I flipped PSU button it flickered like I did try to turn it on. The difference this time is that the 2 chips that were bad last time seem to be fine this time and didn't smoke, but I did see what looked like smoke come out from underneath the board so I instantly unplugged it and could smell it, but can not see any burnt areas or chips with holes in them

Like I said there are only 4 things hooked up to motherboard and I would assume that the motherboard worked when it left MSI repair so it can only be the 4 items I have plugged in that caused it. I dont really know what to do at this point. The only thing that I would guess that could cause this is the power supply. I wouldn't think the cpu and memory would cause this. It could be the cases power switch doing it but I doubt it. I would think the switch just wouldn't work, not short the board.

Any advice on what I should do next??

If I find the problem, what is the chance of them paying for the issues it caused to my other components?
 
As to the 'better' GPU, again, it can come down to the current particular game you are playing.
Will the game run better with more cores for more processing power, and system performance, and improve multitasking or does it need more memory so things are instantly available.
Of course more of both is the goal!

For me, the number of cores would be my deciding factor, but I say again, it may very well vary between games.

As to the motherboard, yes you would think they tested it.
There was no need to have the mobo close to the case and the power button, you can simple short out the two pins on the mobo labelled PWR SW.

You really should have the fans connected for the CPU. The heatsink will give you a few seconds of respite, but CPU's can reach their normal idle temp very quickly. Like within 30 seconds.

If you could smell smoke and think you saw smoke, that is no a good sign.
Either the mobo was not fixed (unlikely) or the fault is with the PSU.
To go further, you need a trusted PSU from another PC that you know works, and another mobo now, as this one is again cooked.
Any hint of smoke or the smell of smoke is an absolute nail in the coffin for electronic components.
 
As long as I am doing this right (I think I am) YES it is the PSU, there is something wrong with the #3 ground pin.

Being that all psu's hook up to all mb (I'm sure there are exceptions) I used the corsair website on how to test PSU.

How to: Test a PSU (Power Supply Unit) | CORSAIR:EXPLORER

www.corsair.com www.corsair.com

Started by using the #24 ground because its at the edge and when I probed all the pins, a few were not exactly right but I chalked that up to lack of knowledge. I had all my result from testing the pins comparing them to the website and realized the #3 pin (ground) has a solid 4.8V

I put black probe on #24 (ground) and the red probe on #3 (ground) and it was 4.8V.
Then noticed that every pin should be putting out volts whereas every pin I tested (except for pin #3) was giving readings in mV
So i put black probe on #3 (ground) and probed all 23 pins. 22 of them all read 4.8V and #14 read .254V
Not only did everything read out in mV but every pin except for 2 all read -4.7mV, -1.5mV for example. Not 1 of the 3 pins read +/- 12 V, they were 0, -4.7mV, +4.8V

Will update when I get this all figured out.
 
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